I'll look further into this today and get back to you.About the extra level look-ahead
Re: About the extra level look-ahead
Oh, of course! I forgot that about alerts. I'll look further into this today and get back to you.
I'll look further into this today and get back to you.Re: About the extra level look-ahead
What Dialogue System version are you using?
I tested this scene in DS 2.2.50.1:
DS_ArticyInstructionTest_2025-01-15.unitypackage
The Dialogue System Trigger is on a GameObject named "ACTIVATE TO START CONVERSATION" that starts inactive. This gives me an opportunity to clear the Console log after the scene starts up, so there are fewer lines to watch while the conversation plays.
I ticked the Dialogue Manager's Alert Settings > Allow Alerts During Conversations to avoid the issue above.
When the final node is not a group node, the order is as you expect:
The thing about group nodes is that they need to process their Conditions and Scripts to check if any children are valid. The children may depend on changes made in the parent's (group node's) Script, which is why it needs to run before evaluating the group node's children. This means that if the final node is a group node, it will do it in the order you don't want.
I tested this scene in DS 2.2.50.1:
DS_ArticyInstructionTest_2025-01-15.unitypackage
The Dialogue System Trigger is on a GameObject named "ACTIVATE TO START CONVERSATION" that starts inactive. This gives me an opportunity to clear the Console log after the scene starts up, so there are fewer lines to watch while the conversation plays.
I ticked the Dialogue Manager's Alert Settings > Allow Alerts During Conversations to avoid the issue above.
When the final node is not a group node, the order is as you expect:
- articyLog.png (199.7 KiB) Viewed 1482 times
The thing about group nodes is that they need to process their Conditions and Scripts to check if any children are valid. The children may depend on changes made in the parent's (group node's) Script, which is why it needs to run before evaluating the group node's children. This means that if the final node is a group node, it will do it in the order you don't want.
Re: About the extra level look-ahead
I'm on the 2.2.46.1 version.
I tested your package and can confirm what you say, the order is respected if the instruction is in a regular node (non-group). And I agree about the fact that depending on the situation, it's crucial that groups run their scripts during this look-ahead step.
To go back to my initial message, that's why I was wondering if it would be possible to disable the look-ahead feature (or precisely to move it just after the last OnConversationLine message), as this is one of the last thing that differ from articy's behavior, now that we have the linear mode. And it case you don't want to allow modifying this feature, do you think it would be too risky to move it by myself (in other terms, is it a problem only for continue buttons, as the documentation says, ?)?
I tested your package and can confirm what you say, the order is respected if the instruction is in a regular node (non-group). And I agree about the fact that depending on the situation, it's crucial that groups run their scripts during this look-ahead step.
To go back to my initial message, that's why I was wondering if it would be possible to disable the look-ahead feature (or precisely to move it just after the last OnConversationLine message), as this is one of the last thing that differ from articy's behavior, now that we have the linear mode. And it case you don't want to allow modifying this feature, do you think it would be too risky to move it by myself (in other terms, is it a problem only for continue buttons, as the documentation says, ?)?
Re: About the extra level look-ahead
Hi,
I'll look into adding an option to not run child group nodes' Script fields at all until after the parent node has fully completed.
I'll look into adding an option to not run child group nodes' Script fields at all until after the parent node has fully completed.
Re: About the extra level look-ahead
Thank you, that would be awesome!
Re: About the extra level look-ahead
Hi Tony,
I read somewhere that you had the Covid, I hope you're recovering well!
I've dug a little deeper into this story of look-ahead thing. Because I don't really need it in my project and mostly because it can provoke some inconsistencies between articy and the dialogue system (with all instructions imported as groups in the database), I tried to add some conditional lines to the Dialogue Manager scripts. The idea is to move the next links evaluation to the OnFinishedSubtitle function (called when the sequencer ends).
It's based on the bool setting useLinearGroupMode of the DS Controller, because it allows for a very linear workflow.
The additions I've made are highlighted in the following images:
First, in the ConversationModel's GetState function, I added an if statement to evaluate links ONLY if we're not in linear group mode. This way, when the model is initialized, links are not evaluated automatically.
That's why in the DialogueSystemController's StartConversation function, I add another if statement to avoid checking if there are no valid entries (making the conversation to back out). Because there are not valid entries yet.
Then, in the ConversationController's OnFinishedSubtitle function, we update the responses and evaluate links. This way, the destination entries of a dialogue node are evaluated just after the sequence of this node ends (including Delay etc...).
I've tested the modifications in a lot of situations, it works rather well! Of course, it resolves my problem with the script of a group node been executed BEFORE the previous dialogue line is spoken (the reason why I created this thread).
I've also found that the BarkController's Bark function needed one more step to retrieve the barks entries:
I'd be curious to get your feedback on these modifications. Do you see any problem that could happen (except for continue buttons)?
I read somewhere that you had the Covid, I hope you're recovering well!
I've dug a little deeper into this story of look-ahead thing. Because I don't really need it in my project and mostly because it can provoke some inconsistencies between articy and the dialogue system (with all instructions imported as groups in the database), I tried to add some conditional lines to the Dialogue Manager scripts. The idea is to move the next links evaluation to the OnFinishedSubtitle function (called when the sequencer ends).
It's based on the bool setting useLinearGroupMode of the DS Controller, because it allows for a very linear workflow.
The additions I've made are highlighted in the following images:
First, in the ConversationModel's GetState function, I added an if statement to evaluate links ONLY if we're not in linear group mode. This way, when the model is initialized, links are not evaluated automatically.
- ConversationModel_GetState.jpg (190.22 KiB) Viewed 1343 times
- DialogueSystemController_StartConv.jpg (312.85 KiB) Viewed 1343 times
- ConnversationController_OnFinishedSubtitle.jpg (202.12 KiB) Viewed 1343 times
I've also found that the BarkController's Bark function needed one more step to retrieve the barks entries:
- BarkController_Bark.jpg (312.58 KiB) Viewed 1343 times
Re: About the extra level look-ahead
Caveat: I'm not back to 100% brainpower just yet, so take this with a grain of salt. But your changes look good, except I think I'd also check that the Dialogue Manager's Reevaluate Links After Subtitle is also ticked when deciding to not evaluate links.
I'll look into incorporating these additions (when I have a clearer head) into DS 2.2.51.
I'll look into incorporating these additions (when I have a clearer head) into DS 2.2.51.
Re: About the extra level look-ahead
Great, I'm glad to hear that this is not pure madness to do this : )
About the grain of salt
, I'm not sure, but I'd rather say that we should check that the Dialogue Manager's Reevaluate Links After Subtitle is also UNticked when deciding to not evaluate links, no? If we don't evaluate links there (because UseLinearGroup is true), they will be inevitably evaluated when the subtitle finishes (by the line added in the conversation controller). The situation in which we have a sequence or a OnConversationLine method that changes the dialog entry's responses should not be a problem, because links are only evaluated when the subtitle finishes, after the sequencer is done and after the OnConversationLine message is sent, right?
But if Reevaluate links & UseLinearGroupMode are both true, links will be evaluated 3 times, which is, indeed, quite an overkill.
Please correct me if I'm wrong
I don't use links reevaluations and it seems to work, but maybe there are special cases where it may be a problem, sure. I hate special cases
About the grain of salt
, I'm not sure, but I'd rather say that we should check that the Dialogue Manager's Reevaluate Links After Subtitle is also UNticked when deciding to not evaluate links, no? If we don't evaluate links there (because UseLinearGroup is true), they will be inevitably evaluated when the subtitle finishes (by the line added in the conversation controller). The situation in which we have a sequence or a OnConversationLine method that changes the dialog entry's responses should not be a problem, because links are only evaluated when the subtitle finishes, after the sequencer is done and after the OnConversationLine message is sent, right?But if Reevaluate links & UseLinearGroupMode are both true, links will be evaluated 3 times, which is, indeed, quite an overkill.
Please correct me if I'm wrong
I don't use links reevaluations and it seems to work, but maybe there are special cases where it may be a problem, sure. I hate special cases